Dr. Brandon Crawford: Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Longevity Formula. I'm your host, Dr. Brandon crawford, and today's guest is Jay Campbell, one of the most recognizable voices in the world of hormone optimization, therapeutic peptides, human performance, and longevity. Jay is a six-time international bestselling author, speaker, entrepreneur, and co-founder of BioLongevity Labs.

For more than 25 years, he's been challenging conventional thinking around testosterone, peptides, metabolic health, and what it truly means to optimize human biology. He's the author of several influential books, including "The Testosterone Optimization Therapy Bible," which I personally read. I have it on my Kindle.

I, I read it every time I fly. His work is helping bring conversations around hormone and peptide optimization into the mainstream. What I appreciate about Jay is that he's not afraid to challenge the status quo, ask uncomfortable questions, and explore where science, human performance, longevity, and personal optimization are headed next.

So Jay, thank you so much for joining us

Jay Campbell: Brian, and thanks for having me, man. I'm honored, humbled, privileged to be here. I think we're gonna have an awesome conversation

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Absolutely. And honestly, I've already personally benefited from having you on because before we pressed record, man, we were going into going into my own testosterone

Jay Campbell: baby.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: and

Jay Campbell: on giving, as you know, is optimized testosterone, right?

Dr. Brandon Crawford: That's right. So I really appreciate your insight there. So, all right. So for my audience, right, they may not fully, you know, know who you are.

Of course, I just read through a little bit about you, but you want to give a little bit about your background and your story just to give some context first?

Jay Campbell: Yeah, absolutely. So, so I'm fifty-five years old. I've been in the performance health optimization space for probably thirty years, but like really convincingly since twenty-six years. So in nineteen ninety-nine when I was almost a month and a half from turning thirty, I got kicked in the testicles playing in an adult men's basketball league.

I lived in Southern California, and I was living in Pasadena at the time. And, you know, I checked myself out, you know, keeled over. Ah, you know what happens when you get kicked in the nuts. And about eight or nine weeks later, I started feeling absolutely run down, like what is going on with me? And, you know, as I like to think there are no coincidences, only synchronicities.

I went to my PPO doctor. At the time, I worked for the Los Angeles Times. I was a classified advertising sales rep And he referred me to an endocrinologist and that-- and the guy happened to... of course, happened to be a Harvard-trained endocrinologist by the name of Dr. Raymond Scruggs. And he took my labs, and he said, "Look, you have the testosterone levels of a geriatric.

I can put you on therapeutic testosterone and have you right as rain in eight to ten weeks. But, you know, go home, talk to your..." At the time it was my fiancée. It was my first wife. She's long gone. Shout out to Kelly. But he said, you know, "Make sure she's okay with it." We didn't have kids or anything, and so we talked, and she was okay with it.

So I did, I went on it. And Brandon, I swear, you know, eight weeks later, just as he said, I started feeling amazing. And so when I went back to see him, you know, for my first treatment, he wanted to take me off, and I was like, "Dude, I'm not coming off this. This is transformational." Like, you know, I had better, better mood.

My brain was just, you know, faster. Everything was just processing faster. And I just felt amazing. And I hadn't built any muscle or, you know, hadn't changed my physique or anything like that at that time 'cause I didn't really understand it that well. I was just taking, you know, a testosterone shot once a week at that time 'cause that's what he told me to do.

And so for the next ten to twelve years, I worked with him, other physicians. I worked with different delivery systems. I did lots of different stuff, you know, testing from, you know, tr- transscrotal cream to s-- you know, arms to upper shoulders. Obviously, I rotated injection sites, and then I worked with a lot of different doctors.

And so at about ten years of doing it, and also, you know, going back into the early 2000s when th- I was doing this, obviously the internet was not where it is now. It wasn't robust. There was no AI. It was very difficult to find information. So I shared information in, like, underground, you know, bodybuilding forums, performance enhancement forums.

And everybody back then didn't have a name. They just had handles, right? Nobody used their name. But as I always say, the signal-to-noise ratio back then was mostly signal, very little noise, 'cause people that were on the internet were really, you know, sophisticated. So I get-- I, you know, I met lots of really smart guys, obviously women too, that were doing the same thing that I was doing.

And so we just kind of were always crowdsourcing information.

my friend said, "Hey, Jay, you know, you know so much about this. Why don't you write a book on it?" And I was like, "Well, you know, I'm not a medically trained professional," and, you know, writing about therapeutic testosterone at that time was still kind of a taboo subject.

So I reached out to Rick Collins, who obviously is a very famous attorney in that, you know, performance enhancement, bodybuilding, professional athletics thing. And, and by the way, Rick was amazing. He knew... I... He didn't know me from Adam, but he responded to me immediately and I asked him, you know, "What would be the risk for a layperson writing a book on therapeutic testosterone?"

And he said, "Well, you know, first off, like, what, who are you? What are you gonna do?" And I said, "Well, I have a white paper and I wanna write this book." He goes, "Well, send it to me and then I'll tell you." So he read it and he said "Wow, this is really good," first off, but he said, you know, there would be risk.

And so he told me that, you know... And at the time, my wife and I my current wife Monica and I, had a residential real estate company. This was, like, in 2014. And I didn't want any risk, so I sh- I shuttered it. And I did send the book though to Nelson Vergel and a couple other people. And Nelson Vergel was, like, kind of the guy back then that wrote the first book on therapeutic testosterone.

It was called Testosterone: A Man's Guide. And he was actually in his country, in Venezuela, when I first sent him the email, and he didn't respond for, like, four months. And then one day he just, in the middle of the night, you know, he sent me an email and he goes, "I don't know who you are, but this is profound and you have to write this book."

And so I wrote him back right away and I said, "Yeah, but Rick Collins." He goes, "I don't care about Rick Collins. Rick Collins is a friend of mine." He's like, "Nobody's gonna come after you. You gotta put this out. You're gonna help men." So anyway, he helped me. That was in mid-2014 and he, you know,

kind of helped me and mentored me and told me what to do, to how to write it.

Also helped

me with some doctors to edit some of the content. But it finally came out in 2015 in November. It was called TRT... The Definitive TRT

Manual. And honestly, it blew up Brandon, on Amazon. You know,

it was, like, the number one selling book on men's health for, like, six

months. A lot of people said that Jeff Bezos read it, right?

Because he went from,

like, you know, the pipsqueak nerdy guy Amazon to the dude where...

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah. Yeah

Jay Campbell: So a lot of people said, "Yeah, well, I mean, it was the number one book on his, on his

site for six months. He probably read it." But anyway after that, obviously that was in

2016 I started lecturing.

I started, you know, talking to lots of people, people like yourself at medical conferences, et cetera. Met everybody on the speaking circuit and then I wrote that obviously landmark book which you've already referenced, which was The TRT Bible in 2018. And subsequently I've wr- written eight more books, you know, on fasting, peptides lots of other stuff and I've just been very, very blessed to meet amazing people, you know, along the way and here I am today.

I just wrote my tenth book which is Living Leaner, Longer, Stronger. And I think it's the best one because it's written for, like, lay people. As you know 'cause you've read my books, they're, they're pretty advanced topics.

But this one, this one is very

general and it's, it's written for somebody who has no exposure

to the things that you and I deal with every single day.

You

know, peptides, hormones bioregulator, stuff like that. Like, they're just not exposed to it. Like, where would we start? And then take me from A to Z. And so I'm really excited about that book to see how it goes

into the mainstream, because I think a lot of

people are gonna

find value in it

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah, and I think this is a, a really good time to have a reference,

Jay Campbell: Exactly

Dr. Brandon Crawford: that because honestly, there's so much confusion and regulatory challenges and, you know, i-i- and yes, while we have access to a lot of these products through, you know, research companies or whatever, there still needs to be proper guidance. and unfortunately the majority of physicians don't know what proper guidance is for, you know, these substances. So, so it's a great time to have that book. So I'm very happy and excited that

you wrote it, so that's awesome.

Jay Campbell: Thank you And, and I agree, by the way. You know, I, I'll say this one of-- an insider in my community who's been with me for a long time said, and this I think the greatest testimonial to it or compliment to it, he said, "Jay, goddammit, you finally wrote a book I can give to my normie brother."

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Oh,

Jay Campbell: I'm like, "There you go, man. That's an amazing compliment." Because as you know, dude, like you and I and people like us are like 10% of the world, you know? The 90% of world still doesn't even know about therapeutic hormones or peptides or any of that stuff. So it's like if we can, you know, break through, I mean, now we're doing

a great job

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yes, absolutely. Well, you know, it's interesting because we have similar stories. you know, my testosterone story, story actually started with a baseball injury.

Jay Campbell: Oh, wow

Dr. Brandon Crawford: took a really hard shot to the nuts and that's what, yeah, that's what started my testosterone challenges. It w- I don't wanna spend a whole lot of time, but I do think, 'cause you brought up this concept of testosterone resistance offline before we started.

Can you give just a little blurb, blurb about what that?

is and what you mean by that?

Jay Campbell: Y- yeah, 100%. So, and, and, you know, credit to Dr. Keith Nichols, 'cause he's really the guy that started it, and him

and I did a bunch of presentations on it. But basically, testosterone resistance

syndrome, what, what he labels as androgen receptors

are desensitized to receiving free testosterone. And he says it's due to,

obviously, and again, you know, very clearly

it's, you know, he-- By the way, he came up with this in 2018, and now here we are in 2026, right?

It's way worse. But basically because we're in such a contaminated environment from, you know, phthalates EDCs, BPA, you know, all the things we were talking about,

atrazine, glyphosate, all these chemicals, you know, forever chemicals I

think they call them now. They're everywhere, Brandon. They're

in our house. They're in our

homes. I mean, they're in our cars. You know, I, I, I remember listening to this guy,

I can't remember his name right now, but he

gave this lecture about every single time we go into our, our, our car that's in the sun, you know, in the summer and the dashboard is under extreme heat,

there's poly...

What are they called? Polyfluorocarbons coming up into the air

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yep. Largest exposure that you can get right there

in the

Jay Campbell: insane how bad we are being exposed to chemicals. And so his argument was that a lot of men, and women for

the, for that part standpoint

have testosterone resistance

syndrome because they have so many of these forever chemicals embed, you know, in the cells.

And so in order to go over that, you really have to work with that individual very closely and look at how much testosterone it takes, meaning therapeutic testosterone, to drive them to a point where they can overcome that inertia where their receptors are just so b- you know, bombarded, so to

speak

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah, absolutely. And that's actually a topic I've been talking about for a very long time. You know, people talking about microplastics and, and forever chemicals, the, the PUFAs, the PFASs. And I always tell people, "Look, your largest exposure is on a hot day, you get in the car, and you're just completely surrounded by these things."

Jay Campbell: Exactly. Dude, that's crazy that you say that 'cause I tell people that all the time too, and I've never, ever heard a person say it the same way. We're, we're-- we must be some sort of Vulcan mind

meld here. That's awesome.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: There you go. Absolutely. Well, with the demographic that I work with and, and with the detox panels or, or the toxin panels I run, and, you know, I see these things all the time, and people will be like, "Well, we're BPA free and we're..." And I'm like, "Okay, Do you do you drive a

Jay Campbell: Do you not have a car, right?

Dr. Brandon Crawford: You know, so, you know, the, the conversation's been coming up for a very long time,

so.

Well, I'm curious, so you've been doing a lot of s- let's just say self-experimentation for 26, 27 years. Has anything ever backfired on you? Has there been a cost to that? Like, what have you learned or what was, like, something that's really happened to you over the past, you know, 26, 27 years that's really benefited us, benefited society, but maybe not so much yourself?

Jay Campbell: Yeah, great question. Nobody's ever asked that, so that's awesome. Let me just say this 'cause I, you know, I'm, I'm very clear about this. One of the things that I haven't done, and obviously it's probably saved me, is I've never abused anything. You know, like I was always... Dr. John Crisler, may he rest in power, he died in 2019 too.

It's funny we're just talking about 2018, 2019, but he died in 2019. But he taught me, he was one of my mentors, he taught me that you started low and you went slow. And as you know, in the pharmaceutical industry, they teach almost everybody to start high and go higher, right? 'Cause that's how they make money.

We

titrate

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah

Jay Campbell: and higher, right? GLPs will eventually get to that. But

So I never abused anything. So it was always This guy where if I'm gonna take something that is foreign or new or I'm a big guinea pig or whatever, I'm

gonna start at a very low amount. So I never ever like, you

know, blew my receptors out or did anything,

you know, that really put me in a position, a position of vulnerability.

But, you know, to your original

question, I mean, dude, I've had shots, you know, that created you, know, like in my quads. I mean, I learned that I can't inject my quads, right? Some people have severe,

I shouldn't say severe, but just really, really sensitive nerve endings, you know, nerve fiber bundles

in their muscles in their legs. And, and I think, and this is my opinion, but I think the leaner you are, the more muscular you are, the, the less likely you can inject in there. But then I've met other people who can inject into their quads with huge, you know, 22 and 23 gauge insulin... I mean, syringes, and they don't have any pain at all.

So we're all biochemically unique and different, but I mean, there's been definitely some times, man, where I debilitated myself from like quad injections or lower leg injections. Where I mean, seriously, like, you know, I got... I wouldn't call it an abscess, but you know, it, it gets

obviously, you know, pink and, you know, very sensitive to the touch and you have to almost have to take some oral antibiotics you know, to make sure that you don't get any

kind of like systemic infection or anything right there.

But, you know, other than that, I've, I, I've been honestly ve- pretty lucky. I've never had any really serious situations. And again, I, I credit that to never going up. And I had many people that would be like, "Dude, you gotta go up. You gotta experience what it's like to go up." And I'm like, "No, I'm, I'm good.

I'm good where I'm

at."

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah. Yeah, that's good. That's good. Okay, so let's kind of transition to this concept of GLP-1s. This

is huge. What, four- 40, 50 million people taking these things right? now that we know of, probably more. And let's, let's kind of start with the concept of dosing, right? And this is something that is maybe one of the most important things that people are gonna get out of this conversation, is that you, you argue, your book argues and I completely agree that...

There you go. Beautiful

book.

Jay Campbell: Dude, this book is insane.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah.

Jay Campbell: It's too much. There's too much words. There's too many, too many pages, too many citations that, you know, my, my copywriter, I-- he got the final word and I was like... 'Cause the, the publishing team wanted a smaller book. You know, they were like, "Look, you guys beat the science to death.

It's awesome, but let's just go a little lower. Let's remove some of the stuff." And he went, I mean, dude, he was gonna kill me if I pulled any of that stuff out. "You're explaining bonds. There's no AI."

But it is an awesome book, and I'm glad that you actually went through it. But go ahead, continue with your question.

But it is, every time I look at it I laugh at it

'cause it's so big

Dr. Brandon Crawford: That's great. I love it. Hey, I'm in Texas where everything's bigger, okay? I'm, I'm-- I like it. This is good. But, but dosing schedules for GLP-1s, standard dosing schedules, they're wrong.

They're, they're

Jay Campbell: 100% insane.

Yeah.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: let's start there

Jay Campbell: Yeah. Well, so I mean, I'm glad you say that, you know, 'cause there's a lot of... not a lot of physicians that are courageous enough to say it, so power to you that you are saying that. But anyone who's used them, whether you're a physician or a layperson, yes, of course, you understand that if you take six milligrams of retatrutide, and obviously, as you know, the studies, dude, they're, they're...

People-- Human dumpster fire humans 12 milligrams a week. Can you imagine if somebody like you or me or our patients took 12 milligrams a week, what would happen to them? I mean, I can't imagine. I don't even wanna think about it. But that's, that's where the studies are, and so it really blows your mind. And again, to, to give Eli Lilly credit, which is hard for me to do,

you know, they created this incredible product, right? I mean, this triple-stage agonist peptide,

which is supposedly now, as of yesterday, gonna come out in the end of March of next year. And g- and God bless them, man. They, as I called it, they smoke and mirrored everybody in the pharmaceutical space in 2026 'cause everyone thought it was coming out in the first or second quarter.

But I'll tell you the truth, you know what I... It

didn't. It didn't come out because Foundeo, which is their oral product, orforglepran, is so amazing that they're like, "If we release this drug, we're gonna cannibalize our sales. You know, we-- Let's, let's, let's run Foundeo." So I mean, honestly, just a quick point or side note

on Lilly.

I, I read something the other day in a you know, an investment, a VC,

Newsletter about Eli Lilly, and I... and by the way, I don't invest in them because it's... I'm, you know, I'm one of those people that like, "Don't invest in the enemy."

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Right.

Jay Campbell: But, but I probably, I probably should consider doing it because I was just looking at what their forecast is, and dude, I'm not joking with this.

With those three products, so it's appetite, obviously Mounjaro, Zepbound, Foundeo, which is orforglepran, their new oral product, and then Retta, dude, they expect them to be a trillion-dollar-a-year business, all three. A trillion. A trillion dollars a year. I, I don't think mo- I, I don't think most people understand how big that number is, but in that report, they said that those three products together, Brandon, will outsell all other pharmaceutical

interventions combined.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah. And I absolutely, I, I absolutely believe it. I mean, if you look at just how many people are already using this right?

now and, and the results, right?

The, the results are, are speaking for themselves. This is not far-fetched, Right

This is not, I mean, you know, I looked at, I looked at SpaceX and I mean, a lot of that valuation baked in a lot of future s-success that may, may not come to fruition.

Anyway, we

won't.

go

there.

Jay Campbell: Likely won't

Dr. Brandon Crawford: exactly. And and so I didn't, you know, I didn't invest in

Jay Campbell: Me, no, me neither

Dr. Brandon Crawford: But, you know, in this forecast, no, this is very likely. Like, absolutely.

Jay Campbell: as you know, I mean, we, we gotta say this again to give them credit. I mean, bro, they are literally eliminating all the competition

I mean, we had a product, which I can't even mention on this podcast anymore because my attorney has told me that they could come after us for defamation, that was a, called a triple receptor molecule that competed against their product, but it had a separate patent, a separate trademark, and it did not infringe on anything they do.

But we were told, literally nine days ago, I got a call from... And you know who this attorney is. Again, I'm gonna keep it all out of this podcast, as I've been advised to do. But they were like, he was like, "Hey, do you... This is serious. Like, do you and Mike wanna go to jail?" And I'm like, "What are you talking about?"

He's like, "If you guys launch blank, you're going to jail. Justice just called me that this is how they're gonna go after you." So I mean, they are literally going to get rid of all the competition, and they, as you know... A- and again, I don't wanna say this from a bad standpoint, they have so much money, there's nothing to stop them.

And Brandon, they're going to get a biological agr- you know, a patent in place, which they shouldn't get, which will absolutely eliminate all competition. It, it... They are gonna have a 15-year window to get as much money as they possibly can with retatrutide, obviously. But as you and I know, and I write about this in the book, you know, in the in what's coming in, in the in what's in the pipeline chapter, dude, there's four, five and six GLPs coming, right?

Like, I was reading about one this morning that is just mind-blowing. It's a stage five, and it's already in stage two trials, and it's just doing so many th- great things, and there's almost no side effects, and they're even dosing it in a micro dose. So, so look, Lilly is smart. They own the government. They own everything.

They own pharma. They are the FDA. I mean, that's not a joke, right? Like, you know, they put out, all the time they put out you know, stuff from Indiana where they're based. You know, their senators are obviously all under their, on their payroll. And it'll be like the craziest thing you've ever read, and it's like, if they had their way, dude, they would eliminate all competitors.

There would be no competitors. And that's what they're trying to do right now. I mean, literally the story is right now in China from the highest level of peptide manufacturers, that they are shutting down all of the bootleg peptide in a vial, the, you know, generic retatrutides, like everybody. And it's, how they're doing it is they're just, they're paying off the manufacturers, right?

And when you are a trillion-dollar company, I think you

can afford to pay off anybody you want. So to not belabor the point, to get back to the microdosing and to talk about it, like again, anybody who's using a GLP-1, 2 or 3 knows that if you take too

much, you feel like you get nauseous you can't even eat.

Even when you come back, you know, your, your, your, your physical sensations to taste are dead. So it never works. And I, and I, I always say

this, which I

think is most important. People have to understand that not eating

is not effective, and I think a lot of people who are fat, you know, or metabolically deranged, they think that not eating is good 'cause they drop weight initially, as you know, but then there's always metabolic haywire to pay, right?

Thyroid damage They lose muscle, their hair falls out, they have muscle collapse in the face,

butt, back, et cetera, and they look, you know, terrible. They look like De- Demi Moore. Remember the picture from Demi Moore

from, like, three months ago? She looked like a rotting corpse. And you're seeing tons of

these celebrities, et cetera, famous people that have used them and lost all this weight, but as you know, they look horrible 'cause they're not doing it correctly.

They're not lifting weights, they're not hormonally optimized, they're not eating enough protein. You know, all the things that we talk about in the book and that you know how to do that most people don't. And I, I don't really blame

the physician community. I blame the prescriber... I mean, not the prescriber, but the pharmaceutical manufacturers and their reps because again, the, the, the, the, the weekend class is used to prescriber, you know, the insert, the package

insert. That's what they tell them to use

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah. With, with no formal training really true. Okay, it's interesting you say that. I was talking to someone it was probably a few months ago, and the topic of peptides came up and, you know, they started talking about, "Oh yeah, I've been on tirzepatide for several months now." And, and I was like, "Really?

How do you feel?" And he was like, "Oh, well, I've lost, you know, 10 or 15 pounds." And I'm like, "Yeah, but how do you feel?" He goes, "Well, I vomit almost every day for about three days after I take the injection but then I'm okay." And I'm like, "Whoa,

whoa,

wait a minute. Let's, let's hold up here. Like, that's not how you should be

Jay Campbell: Dude, that's literally 90% of people using

GLPs. Think

about that

Dr. Brandon Crawford: so I said, "Did, did you tell your prescribing physician that you're feeling this bad?" And I said-- And he said, "Yes." And I said, "Well, what did he say?" And he said, "Oh, it's just part of it." And I said, "Did he increase your dose?" He said, "Yeah, because it was time to increase the dose." And I'm like, "Okay, stop."

Right? I'm like, "Just stop." But this is exactly what's playing out all across the nation, all across the globe. And it's sad, right? Because you do have something that can be really effective and es-especially if used properly. But then, so that kinda dovetails into this next discussion, right? Because, because I'm a brain guy,

and so we have

GLP-1 receptors scattered all over our neurology, areas

like the nucleus tractus solitarius, which is an area that I love to talk about, the area postrema, the ventral tegmentum area the amygdala, the limbic system, the prefrontal cortex, the hippocampus and all of those are just off of memory.

I'm probably missing some. Okay. But, but there's this very clear mesolimbic,

Jay Campbell: Yes

Dr. Brandon Crawford: reward pathway, dopamine pathway that seems to be influenced by GLP-1s, and the concept-- Or g- let's just say GLPs, because you're right, GLP-1, 2, 3,

Jay Campbell: sure

sure

Dr. Brandon Crawford: So the idea here is it's not just a mechanistic, "Hey, you're full," type of signal, "Stop eating."

No, it's, it's actually getting into that reward circuit, that salience network of food craving, okay? But then

how else is this playing out? Is this now affecting libido? Is it affecting motivation? Is it affecting joy? Is it, you know... Like, w-where does that stop, right? 'Cause this isn't just food craving.

So what are your, what are your thoughts here?

Jay Campbell: Yeah, no, that's a very salient point. And, and very truthfully, now you're seeing this. And again, this all goes back to what you and I just talked about. It's abuse of dosing principles. When you abuse dosing principles and you deal with what you talked about, which is, you know, the vomiting and God knows what else, you know?

I mean, I mean, again, we, we should, we should address these. And by the way, you know, for everybody who's watching this, all of this, as Brandon knows, is exhaustively covered in the first three chapters. I mean, I actually tell most people, like, if the first three chapters... The first chapter's fine. The second and third chapter goes through all the side effects, and we dispel all of them, but it's like it is exhausting.

So if you're-- if, if it, if it bogs you down, just go to

the end and just read the key findings at the chapter and then get into four, five, six, and seven and eight, which are obviously really awesome. But the truth is, is that when you abuse it, whether it's a one, two, or three, and obviously there's only ones and twos are FDA approved now, but the threes are coming and the research community has been using Retatrutide for three years.

And dude, I'm sure you know this, compounders have been making Retatrutide for two years, which is a whole nother podcast in and of itself 'cause of the stupidity of that. But obviously, Lilly just sued one of them two weeks ago, and I'm sure that's gonna open the door. And, and by the way, that was Stryker.

And, and that's gonna open the door for many more. But not to, not to belabor that point, to continue on yours 'cause it's important, People are having dopamine reward and signaling issues after four to six months of overuse or abuse let's just call, let's just call it abuse, of these products. And it's showing up as no sex drive.

It's showing up as no desire you know, to engage in, like, normal things that would give you, you know, the excitement of, you know, dopamine reward and, and, you know, up and down and all that stuff, and serotonergic pathways and all of those things. So it's really, really risky if you're not using these in a microdose fashion.

And if you are using them in a microdose fashion, I haven't seen it affect negatively those pathways, but as you do know, it affects them very positively because we've all heard stories. And again, look again, it's all in the book. There's lots of studies where it stops alcoholism.

It

Dr. Brandon Crawford: I was gonna bring that

up.

Jay Campbell: It

stops, porn, weed, vaping.

Again, all these obsessive compulsive disorders that people have because obviously there's tweaking going on in their brains. Again, serotonergic, you know, dopaminergic, dendritic, all these pathways are being tweaked for various reasons, and we're all, again,

biochemically unique. And if this drug, and again, it's TIRZ, you see it a lot in the studies in TIRZ, and obviously you're gonna see it

in Retatru because there's just not as enough Retatru studies coming out, but that many will be coming out soon about

this.

But it's clearing

those, those issues. And by the way, I've talked to

people who started both TIRZ and

Retatrutide and said, "Hey, I wanted to lose ten to fifteen pounds." And they did it

right. They microdosed it. And they said, "You know what? After six

weeks, I, I couldn't drink alcohol anymore. I stopped drinking alcohol completely." I've had people tell me that they stopped smoking weed. You know, I've had people tell me that they, you know, they would smoke a cigarette

whenever they got really, really anxious. They b- rarely smoked, but it just killed the desire or the craving to ever even do that. So

as you said earlier in this show, I think that the real future of GLPs is what it's doing to the reward pathways in the brain

and how we can modulate, you know, obviously curing obsessive compulsive disorders, but now we're gonna go even deeper, like,

you were saying, with like, you know, diabetes, type three diabetes, neurological things and, you know, even autism, stuff like that.

I think that that's where we'll go because, again, these drugs are such powerful pharmaceutical interventions. But as you know, the... again, it's just the difference between a pill and a poison is the dosage, and you have to understand how to use them as tools because they're not the greatest things in the world if you don't do all the other things right, which, as you know, is obviously written about in this book too.

But I really do think that the future of these is way beyond metab-

metabolic medicine

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, as I'm listening to you speak about this, I was actually I had a family member talking to me that is you know, microdosing. They're using tirzepatide appropriately, and I'm, I'm actually the one monitoring

this, and so I know, I, I know, they're doing it right. And they did actually mention to me the other day, they said, "You know, I don't really need coffee anymore.

I don't really reach for it anymore," right? They're like I might drink half a cup in the morning, but I don't really go to it anymore." And I was, and, and I didn't really think about that until, like, just now that, you know, that's kind of a, that's along the same pathway. And then you're right, there are there are actually, there's good literature out there talking about how this can help reduce alcoholism, drug abuse all the things that you were talking about, right?

Porn addiction all these types of things, right? So It's-- it's a double-edged sword, right? We can use this greatly to our benefit but It, can also be abusive, and then we can, you know, fall into the other bucket there.

Jay Campbell: It's-- It, it comes down to education. You know, as I say in the book in the first chapter, 95% of people, as you talked about with your friend or whatever, you know, are exposed to these things with, with poor

dosing instruction.

They're not informed correctly. And again, I don't blame the doctors because as you know, they do.

They go to a weekend class, and the doctors are taught to use the package insert and to titrate people higher when they, you know, lose effectiveness. I mean, think of how insane that actually is because, you know, most doctors are obviously aware of the dose response curve and titration methods and to start people at so high, yeah, yeah, supposedly exactly, but, but to start so high and then to go higher, knowing what we're seeing in the mainstream, to me is what's so confounding about it.

But I mean, again, and I'll, I'll sing this, you know, to the top of the rooftops forever. If you use these responsibly and you do the things that you know you have to do with them, which obviously again, they're very powerful tools. Even in microdose, you have to lift weights, you have to eat enough protein, you have to do cardiovascular training, you have to live insulin controlled, you have to modulate, you know, EMF and get enough sleep at night, et cetera.

But if you do all those things, and I know it's very, very tough for most people in America today to do all those things now because there's just... You know, everybody's in survival programming, as you know. You know, it's just like the costs keep going up and everybody's got to put food on the table and put their kids through college and put their kids through, you know, sport and travel sports and club sports and all these things.

And so people are just enslaved from a mindset standpoint, and so they just run out of energy or they run out of time or both to do all those things. But

if you can do all those things, and thankfully there are enough people that are using these things responsibly, as you said, dose res- dosed and dosed response curves,

they're amazing. I mean, there's, there's, nothing like it. Like I say this all the time

now. Again, I'm 55 and my wife's 54, and I can walk around all year

round with a complete shredded six-pack, which I could not do in my mid-40s unless I was dieting, and I don't have

to diet. And that's how powerful these tools are. Again, if you do all

the other things and obviously, you know, the other things would also be hormonal optimization, you know, using mitochondrial peptides, et cetera.

But I couldn't do that in my mid-40s, Brandon, because these tools were not there. So I always tell people the best way to use a GLP is to learn how to

use it and then when you want to use it, it's in the back of your mind that you can use it for any specific reason. But for me, like I just use a little tiny microdose of retatrutide now, you know, monthly.

I mean, I probably take a couple of shots a month, and it just keeps my metabolism humming. So to the point where it's like, you know, I don't have to be so restrictive and so spartanistic in the way I eat and approach food because it's obviously optimizing my metabolism and for all the other things that you say, and I see this in women a lot It really, really mediates or, or ameliorates food noise.

And I think for most women, because as you know, women are emotional-based eaters, they crave certain things when they become emotional or anxious or whatever, it really calms that nerve or calms that setting in their brain. And so they become much more on plan from an eating standpoint when they're doing this

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Right, right, right. And I'll-- I, I do wanna circle back, you brought up autism. And this is, this is a thought experiment.

Jay Campbell: Sure.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: that,

That, that I've engaged with, I actually with other colleagues, one specifically, where it, it is plausible to consider how GLP-1 or GLPs could influence autism or autism symptoms because of how it seems to influence the hypothalamus and the PALM-C networks.

So there's some very, very, very interesting concepts right there. To date, I have not, you know, done this. I have not used it with any autistic patients. Maybe that's something that we'll pursue in the future. But but it's some really, really interesting plausible links, man. I mean, truly.

Jay Campbell: Yeah, there's no doubt. And, and I would also mention, and again, I, I don't work with any autistic people with these either, but I have heard of mothers that have used them with some of their autistic sons, like late teenage years to lose weight, right? Because they are obviously very powerful metabolic tools.

I would just mention that again, when you're using the, let's just call it the stage three, and obviously there's better tools now if you threw in like, you know, our product, FLGR242, the myostatin inhibitor along with that,

plus clotho, you know, you're, you're, you're just improving cel- cellular

signaling and connections.

But, but insulin, if you can really, really control insulin signaling sensitivity and nutrient partitioning, especially in people like that who obviously, you know, are,

Usually having to be coached or, you know, actually directed and

guided from a food standpoint, you're gonna keep them much more focused because obviously their, you know, their brains, the way their brains work, they're not gonna be running around eating shitty food all the time.

And that's also a really awesome thing when you can do for people that, you know, normally wouldn't be so, call it organized or s- focused and centered on eating the right way. A microdose of this will keep them on the narrow because like a lot of guys, you know, will say this too, and, and really in the biohacking space, when you're on a microdose of GLP-3, you really don't want to eat shitty food.

Like, it's teaching you that your body needs glycogen restoration, right? So it's like, okay, I'm gonna eat clean carbs versus a donut because my body is gonna tell me that, you know, the gastric, the, the delayed gastric emptying, the slow release, like that food, the sugar and the fat combined is not working for me.

But if I eat more white rice or more yams or more greens, I feel better. So it just, it's, it's kind of like that natural feedback loop where your body is telling you, "Hey dude, now that you got me on this microdose of a GLP and everything is humming along, you can't give me bad energy or bad, you know, fuel.

You got to give me good fuel." So I think for an autistic, you know, especially an adult, you know, a later eight, you know, late teens, early twenties, I think that's gonna be really good for them because they're not gonna be eating shitty

food.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah, absolutely. And you're right. I've talking to a lot of people that have started GOPs and they're like, "I don't really want to eat crap anymore." They just don't. And then So yeah, absolutely. Well, you bring up Klotho and myostatin inhibitors.

That's, that's the next place I wanted to go. Introduce that topic for us. What is this Klotho thing, man? How is this gonna extend lifespan and do all these things? What is this?

Jay Campbell: So Klotho is really an endocrine protein, but our chemist, Mike Farber, has engineered it with his, you know, patented 19-day albumin binding construct, which is a 19-day novel half-life that he can atten- almost attach to really any drug affinity complex. So it's really a fascinating thing that he's created.

But he's-- the first two mo- molecules that he's made are the Klotho protein, which I'll get to in a second, and then the second one is FLJ2422, which is a modified alba- s- I'm sorry, a modified myostatin inhibitor. So it's a, it's basically a, if, if you're familiar with follistatin, it's a patented modified form of follistatin.

And, and again, the, the problem with all the f- previous follistatin molecules were they were, A, was a super short half-life. So the only way you could get any effect is you'd have to, you know, inject yourself three or four times a day, and then you'd also have to inject it locally, you know, to increase myos- myokine expression at the, at the place of injection.

So for like bodybuilders or even professional athletes, like if they were trying to, you know, improve something, they would have to inject it right into the actual muscle they were trying to get bigger or stronger or faster or whatever. But the negative of, of that was that it would also bind to activin.

And as you know, activin is found in a lot of our internal organs, so you could get like an increase in heart size, you could get an increase of other internal organs, liver, spleen, kidneys, et cetera. So that is all those past my- fo- follistatin products had that issue, but this one is uniquely designed so it doesn't bind to activin.

So you will never have any kind of like aortic valve or heart or any kind of, again, internal organ growth. And all it really will do is suppress obviously myostatin, which as you know is the governor to muscle satellite cell formation, and it suppresses it enough that the body, through the novel patented albumin binding construct, is sending it through your blood plasma.

So it's very, very uniquely delivered, and as you take it, even in very, very, very tiny dosages, if you're eating correctly and again you're controlling for all the things we've talked about on this podcast, you can easily put on five to seven pounds in like six to eight weeks, and it's real skeletal mass.

So it's an amazing product. And I would just also mention, and then I'll get to klotho, is that it's a great product, Br- Brandon, for people using GLPs because it really prevents muscle loss, which as you know is the number one symptom/side effect of using GLPs incorrectly is catabolism, right? They're not eating enough protein.

They're very powerful metabolic tools, and they do speed up metabolism, and they do enhance thyroid production. And so a lot of people who don't eat enough protein or tr- or resistance train lose body f- I mean, lose muscle at the same time they're losing fat, which as you know is the number one no-no when you're trying to lose weight.

Klotho again being an endocrine protein let me just take a step back. So klotho for like the last eight years is probably the number one place that longevity research has been going into because when you really look at the klotho protein, you see that it's responsible for so many cellular, you know, connecting systems, you know, bioenergetics.

I mean everything. It's, it's, it, it improves endothelial tissue sensitivity. It strengthens the phosphate channel and ion clearing in the kidney. It strengthens vascular health and brain health. I mean, it does so many things. And so like if you could take it synthetically and extend the half-life of it like Mike has done, you could atten- you know, t- physiologically lower the cellular age of the, the organism.

So what's happening when people take it is it's basically lowering your cellular and biological age. So like a s- and, and we've had literally, dude, now in the 50s women who are 65 and older who started it within one week started menstruating again.

Now, yeah, I mean, I... We got lots of women doing that.

Now, it's really, they're not really menstruating. I was talking to a doctor about this the other day, but they're sloughing off the lining, you know, of the uterus, which is actually good and healthy 'cause when you get older, you're not having that anymore, obviously, that you did when you were having your period.

So, but it's doing a lot of things. Like, the one thing that it's done for me, and I've actually been on it now for, it'll be,

in September, it will be a full year and obviously being I'm one of the first people to start it along with the manufacturer and my, of course, my wife, is that I, I don't have nearsightedness anymore.

So I always had to wear glasses at night for, like, the last three years, and I stopped wearing my glasses about March of this year. And I never even put it two... I never put two and two together. I just stopped wearing them. And then the other night, Monica was, my wife was saying to me, she's like, "Why are you not wearing your glasses?"

And I'm like, "I don't need to." And so we were kind of joking. I was like, "It's got to be clotho." But, you know, I've heard from other people too that they've also, it's improved either their nearsightedness or their farsightedness. You'll also notice hearing improvement. The number one effect for most aging men and women, and when I say aging men and women, I want to say 40 and up, is sexual improvement.

And again, because of the endothelial tissue sensitivity, men get very, very harder erections, more sensitivity. Women have more powerful orgasms. I mean, almost every woman that I've heard from that has taken this, within the first month, that's the number one feedback response is that, "My orgasms are more heightened.

I'm much more sensitive." So it is a very, very, very powerful molecule. And, you know, my, you know, obviously our chemist and, you know, says to everybody, you know, when he does live streams, which he does a lot now is that if you're 40 and up, you should be on it, you know. You take it every two weeks. So it's a 10-microgram dose, and you only have to inject it twice a month.

And so the way it is or the way it's measured is like... And, and by the way, just so you know, there's one company in the world that measures intracellular levels of clotho, and they're in Switzerland. And I think the test, like, it's like

13 grand. It's insane.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: looked at it before hopping on here actually. Yeah

Jay Campbell: It's so insane. There, now there are people out there like, you know, obviously Dr. Shi at Genfinity, he, he measures klotho, but he's not measuring circulating free levels of klotho like you would need for the test. So if anybody's taking that test, don't, don't look at that measurement and, and, and, and, and compare it to like your levels of klotho if you're using BioLongevity Labs form.

But, you know, I do wanna say there are other manufacturers of klotho, and they're selling it in different forms. There's like modified fragments. You know, Dr., Dr. Khan, Adil Khan, you know, they have the medi-chlor-- the, what is it called? The midi-chlorian guys down there at the

economic free zone off the coast of Honduras, and they're

doing like CRISPR gene editing, and they're injecting,

you know, klotho and modified follistatin and all this.

But I don't think any of that, especially for the cost, 'cause that's like 80 grand. But for

the cost compared to what we've done with, again, Mike Farber's modified albumin

binding construct, I don't think anything compares. And again, you know, I can tell you this now because it's been in the marketplace for about 10 months.

We have literally tens to 20 to 30,000 people all over the world using both of these products, and all the reviews are rave. I have not had a single person that's come back and say, "Hey, you scammed us," or, "It doesn't work," or, you know, "I don't notice anything." The only complaint that we get is that some people, the albumin binding construct, when they first inject it, it stings because their body has to build up a tolerance to it.

And again, when... You know what I mean by that. It's like a s- a, a mild post-injection pain, but it's nothing that, you know, you can't handle. It's not creating like welts or, you know, things that are really, really bad. But you can't inject it the follistatin, you cannot inject into the muscle, especially initially, because obviously it does expand and goes through the pl- blood plasma, and you don't wanna do that in, if you inject into the muscle 'cause you will get a welt.

And I've sh- you know, people have sent me screenshots of their red welts injecting it, you know, 'cause they're like, "Oh, I injected it into my thigh. There's so much fat in there." Your thigh is a muscle, dude. You know? So it's like you can't inject. So always inject into like the sub-Q area, you know, to like the right and left, like in the suprapubic region of, of the, of the center a-

adiposity

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Okay. So, okay, I have so many questions

Jay Campbell: Yeah, please

Dr. Brandon Crawford: I, I wish I had another hour with you, but okay. So I, I think one of the primary things going through my head any known contraindications medication interactions, anything to be very aware of, right? Like, hey, if you're this person, don't go start taking this 'cause you might die or something.

Jay Campbell: Yeah, great question. So, so far nothing, and obviously the, the drug has been used for two years. For humans, it's 10 months animals for a year. Mike is a very, very safe guy. He does everything go low, start, start slow. People-- the one thing I would warn is do not take more. You know, it's not more is better.

Ten micrograms every two weeks is all you wanna do. There are a lot of people, older people that are taking half a vial every week, so they're, so they're taking five micrograms weekly versus one injection every two weeks. That's fine. I mean, again, the half-life of the, of the binding construct is designed to go nineteen days, so it really doesn't matter.

With FLGR dosing, a lot of people have found that they like dosing in the

morning of their workouts. So you will get some people that are like ch- dosing it three or four times a week, but you still can only dose it once a week or once every two weeks if you want to. But I think everybody just kind of uniquely experiments on themselves and will, you know, find a dosing strategy that best mimics, you know, how they feel or what's happening to them.

But no, there's no known contraindi- indications. I can also tell you this, that we've had people now on it for ten months, and about eight of them have done full Prenovo scans, full, full-body radial MRIs to look for internal organ enhancement or size, and they, they did-- they all took baselines before they started.

Not a single ounce of growth anywhere other than just muscle growth. So again, it's only affecting androgen receptors, you know, on the outside of the body. So I, I would say the other thing just to be aware of, which is, you know, really mind-blowing about FLGR is that if you don't eat enough, you're gonna get ripped.

Because again, it's such a powerful myokine-producing, you know, as you shut off obviously myostatin, the body is being flooded with myokines. So as long as you are eating enough, you should build muscle, but a lot of women don't eat enough, and they'll feel fatigued because it's such a metabolic amplifier, and they still get super lean, like they lose fat.

You know, we have had tons of women that are sending us shots, you know, in their sixties and seventies in their bathing suits are showing like eight week... You know, here I am at the beginning, here's eight weeks later, and you're like, "Wow." Right? So it's a very, very powerful molecule, but so far nothing, no contraindications, and nobody has reported any really negative side effects other than the welt, the

post-injection

Dr. Brandon Crawford: And maybe they just wanna have sex more often is what I'm hearing,

Jay Campbell: dude, everyone on clotho, everyone on clotho. I mean, look, man, my wife and I,

we, we, we were talking about this like three months ago. We were like, "I don't know how we could ever not do this." You know? Like, like, like we have to buy years of supply of

this. Like, you know, if, if, if we ever go under or somebody comes after us like that

three-letter acronym company and says, "You can't make this," you know, we gotta, we gotta somehow get a fr- you know, an ice...

An i- a freezer storage room where we can have the next 30 years of clotho. But no, honestly, Brandon, I'm not joking. It's that awesome of a molecule. And the older you are, the more discerning and more, more like subtle the changes are. The... Not saying it's not helpful if you're 40, but you, you know, the, the...

obviously you're just... You're producing a lot less circulating clotho in your 50s and 60s than you are in your late 30s and early 40s. But you'll still notice improvement regardless. But again, Mike says if you're under 40, there's probably not a real need to do it unless you have kidney issues. Because that's what we think we're gonna end up showing its b- the greatest benefit is reversing PKD or CKD, you know, polycystic kidney disease, because we're doing a study right now in what do you call it?

A Phase 1a in China and it's, it's in humans, and so far the early duddy sta- data is showing that it is reversing it. And I can, I can tell you this right now, we have some very high level call it celebrity A-list people who've had dist- what would... I, I would just call it destabilized kidneys, and they are, you know, now six months, four months, five months into it, and every single one of them is reporting c- positive findings and that it's improving kidney function.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: That's amazing. I I haven't looked into this. I'm just curious if you know with how klotho declines with age, is there also a correlate with chronic stress or some ty- like d- does some type of stress or chronic stress or something like this actually influence klotho levels and therefore our health span?

Jay Campbell: Yeah. I mean, the... So the answer is yes. I mean, there's no question that Klotho is cessating just like our hormones are cessating as we get older. The more, you

know, the more... I- just put it this way, the, the worse your physiological

condition, so the more free oxyradical, the more, you know,

ROS obviously the more glycated end products you have.

So again, we're talking about metabolically deranged people, obese people, lots of visceral fat and inflammation. Those people are gonna have a faster decline of Klotho than healthier people. But there's no question that you can supplement regardless of your physical condition by just injecting 10 micrograms every two weeks.

I mean, honestly, we've had some people who have told us it's the greatest thing in their entire life. You know, they, they send us a message like, "I'm on it for four weeks, and it's done this for me, and I can't even tell you..." I mean, like I said, the best ones are the women that call, you know, that, that freak out and they, you know, their, their gynecologist is freaking out 'cause they're like, "What's going on?

What have you done?" And we're like, "Dude, if you're, if you're bleeding or you're menstruating, and again, you're sloughing off, you're becoming a healthier, younger, more fertile cellular organism, so it's good. Don't stop. You know, don't freak out and stop." But, but as you know, dude, I mean, if you're 60 or 70 and you haven't bled since you were 48 and all of a sudden you start bleeding again, you're gonna, you're gonna, you're

gonna ask what the

is

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Sure. Absolutely. So, so I'll admit, I have the FLGR product from, from your company, okay? I actually got it at this year's BioHacking Conference, right? I was there. I was actually set up representing our lasers, like, right next to the, to the booth. So I walk over there and I'm like, "Hey, this looks interesting."

I got it. I just haven't used it yet because, you know, the guy at the booth gave me, like, some recommended

Jay Campbell: Of course.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: I'm the one that's gonna, you know, I'm like, "Okay, I'm gonna do my own research." So it's just sitting

Jay Campbell: Of course. So I'm gonna tell you what to do. I'm

gonna tell you

what

Dr. Brandon Crawford: there you go.

Okay,

Jay Campbell: you're gonna put one cc of bacteriostatic water in it, and then you're gonna take two shots. Well, it's up to you. You could take one, you could take, So one vial could last two weeks. Th- this is what I recommend for people that have not had any exposure to the albumin binder, and this is for men and women.

Women, of course, dose is either half or a third of the men's dose. But you could probably just start with one cc and inject half the vial once a week for the first four to six weeks. So you're getting obviously 2.5 milligrams per shot, and you're going once a week. And then after four to six weeks, when your body is acclimated to the albumin binder, double the dose.

But if you really wanna be adventuresome and you wanna get better and faster results immediately you could just take one shot twice a week of the whole vial, so essentially one vial a week, and that will give you five milligrams a week. And I guarantee you, Brandon, in 10 days you're gonna be like, "Holy

So what people notice first with follistatin is pumps in the gym are insane. Like, you're like, "What is going on?" You know? You're... You got more muscle glycogen. You're stronger. Your force production is incredible. And before you even ask, 'cause I know you're a doctor and you're gonna ask me, you're like, "Is it just, is it, is it capable?

Is it, is it strengthening the co- you know, the connective tissue and the tendons and the mu- you know, musculoskeletal areas?" And it does. And you know, very, very truthfully, I've been telling people this, 'cause again, I'm 55 and I've been on it now for since December. So again, what is that? Nine months.

And it has completely changed my upper physique. I never in my life could ever build, like, a chest wall or, like, a shelf right here. Like, I always had a really good physique, but it's completely changed my upper muscle, you know, just call it my u- my upper chest wall. Like, the separation, you know, down here through the sternocostoid, all that has changed.

And it's nothing that I'm doing for my training. It's obviously nothing. I only just take, you know, therapeutic testosterone, 150 milligrams a week. It's that. And honestly, I will tell people, you know, 'cause people are always like, "Ooh, is it permanent, bro? Or do you gotta just stay on it forever?" And I'll tell people this, like, some of it is permanent, but as you know, there's nothing permanent unless you keep doing what you're doing, right?

Like, if I stop lifting weights and stop living my lifestyle, stop taking therapeutic testosterone, would I hold onto it? Of course not. But if you do what you always do, you absolutely can come off for probably six to eight months of it, maybe even a year, and keep what you kept, you know? And that's the thing is I, you know, I went on it for six months, and then I went off of it for 68 days, and I just started it again at the beginning of August, and it's better the second time So, you know, you know, Mike Farber, again, the chemist and the manufacturer and formulator, he keeps telling-- He's 75, by the way.

He keeps telling us, he's like, "Dude, you can keep, keep taking it forever, and every single time you

take it, you're going to continue to change and modulate your physic-- physical expression," because again, it's improving the androgen receptor sensitivity in areas that you are always very resistant.

So for guys who are taking it, you're going to get thicker, more dense, and more muscular in the areas that were always your trouble spots.

So again, that's why it's one of those things where people are gonna just love

it, you know, as

they become more exposed to

it.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: That's awesome.

Jay Campbell: is. It's, it's literally a revolution in, in, in, and I would say physique augmentation. It, it-- There really is... I mean, look, I had a guy yesterday, or not

yesterday, but like three days ago, he messaged me on X.

He's a chemist, and he's been using it for five months, and he sent me this long, detailed scientific breakdown of like what he thinks about it. And he said, "Dude, I'm not gonna lie to you." He goes, "I think you got testosterone, and then you got growth hormone, and then you got this." He's like, "In the history of performance enhancement."

He's like... Because it, it doesn't cau- it doesn't cause side effects, right? As you know, with anabolics and androgenics, there's always a plus and minus. You know, people can take low doses of Anavar or Primobolan or any of those things, and they can get great results, but you're tearing up ApoB, ApoA. You know, you're-- There's always you're robbing Peter to pay Paul.

You know, there's long-term negative side effects, as we all know. You know, HDL gets lowered. You know, you're just doing stuff to I would just call it your small particles that are not pr- you know, conducive to living a long life. Whereas with this, with this product, there's... I mean, again, I, I, it's, it's so hard for me to say it, but there's so far no known side effects other than just enhanced musculature and more

body fat loss.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: Yeah. Man, so I'm excited, man. I've got, I've got some homework I'm gonna do.

I

Jay Campbell: And

I'll give you my cell, and you can text me after this call if you have any questions too, of

course.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: I really appreciate that. I truly do.

Jay Campbell: definitely

Dr. Brandon Crawford: well, like I said, I, I truly could talk to you for, you know, an hour or longer, probably longer. I've got-- I do have patients I need to

Jay Campbell: Of course, man. We'll do part two.

We'll do part

two.

Dr. Brandon Crawford: is there, is there, is there anything we didn't cover or anything you'd also like to tell the world, the viewers, anything else? I, I do want you to show the book again 'cause I really want people to go out and read this

Jay Campbell: Yeah. So th- so

this is, this is the February book, but the newest book is, which I don't have 'cause my wife took it out of here. I don't know where it is right now, but don't worry about it. It's called Living Leaner, Longer, Stronger. It has a picture of

my ugly mug on the front front of it. It's actually

a beautiful cover not because it has

my mug on it, it's just a really awesome design.

But that book is really the gateway,

Drug to the universe that you and I

live in every single day and eat, eat, breathe, and sleep. And again, it's written for very, very,

How would I say it? Newbies, you know. You could call them normies, newbies, just people that

have no exposure to the world that you and I are in.

So I highly recommend that book. And you know, if people want more information for a

lot of the stuff I talked about today, they can go to a domain that we designed, my team has designed. It's jcampbell.com/free-info, and you can get a c- a downloadable free PDF copy of every book, not Living Leaner, Longer, Stronger yet 'cause it's brand new, but this one was just put up there.

So there's like nine books that you can download, The Testosterone Bible that you mentioned, and there's other, a lot of other awesome books. The p- you know, the Optimizer Health with Therapeutic Peptides is there. So that's where I would go to get

more information

Dr. Brandon Crawford: That's awesome. We'll put that info in the show notes as well. So, everyone, if you enjoyed this episode, if you think that someone else could benefit from this information, we talked about a lot of stuff, and I think that this information we covered is very important. It's important for critical thinkers.

It's important for people that are willing to think outside the box and actually analyze their own health and the actual scientific data that is applicable to living a longer, healthier, more optimized life. So if, if that's you, if that's someone that you know, please like, share, subscribe, do all the things that you know to do because the reason we're doing this today is to actually help people like you.

That's the whole point. That's why we're taking time out of our day. That's why Jay's writing these books, is to help people. So please share this content. We'd really appreciate it. And again, Jay, you're such a, a wealth of knowledge. I really appreciate you. Again, thanks for doing all the things that you're doing.

Thank you for your time today. I really have enjoyed

this

Jay Campbell: Brandon, thank you, man.